The Cult of Lard

[guillotine 16070xp 0]

Much as @solar wrote, I can think of examples of this sort of tribalism in all hobbies and professional activities I’ve been involved in. PC vs Mac, bikes vs ebikes, Nikon vs Canon… and let’s not forget sports fandom which quite insanely spills into physical violence at worst!

 

Few years ago there was a thread in these forums about the negativity in the hobby and how to block that out. I’ll try to find, it has wise words. Given how much negative shit there is in the world and in our lives, why does anyone want to dwell in that in the hobby that is supposed to be the counter to all that.

EDIT: found the thread https://www.ontabletop.com/forums/topic/staying-away-from-negativity-in-the-hobby/

[jamescutts 7057xp 2]

So its been a while since this topic was touched but I felt the need to revisit it. Recently a wargamer posted, a rather lengthy and I think well put together critique of Chain of Command, initially on the Yarkshire Gamers Reet Bit Wargames Group, but also reposted on reddit. The reddit post is here as its publicly viewable: https://www.reddit.com/r/wargaming/comments/1v47o3n/chain_of_command_a_nuanced_critique/

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1394761557711606/permalink/2462934047561013/

Now I don’t know the full story behind it, but it appears the author was called out previously for saying they were not a fan of Chain of Command in some form and had critism which others called out saying it wasn’t valid. Whatever happened the author then penned this critique. Personally I find a lot of points I agree with, others I disagree with, but regardless, I think the author explained their throughs from there point of view pretty well, perhaps a bit overwrought at times. Anyway the game in questions not really the point, I don’t really see that as anything more than personal views to be agreed and disagreed.

What I have found disappointing, is reading the responses from a few members of the lard community, theres a lot of frankly aggressive replies, there are in fairness some much more reasoned ones too. Now the author lashed out several times, and honestly while I don’t condone it I can see why, the almost organised response to a call to defend chain of command as being the best thing since sliced bread seemed to have been triggered, and it brought back a lot of memories of this topic and why I stepped away from the lardie community (I don’t count James’ fantastic Midgard in the same circle as it feels like i has its own Identity and has been nothing but amazing from my engagement with it).

The biggest disappointment was actually from the Lardies themselves, now I’ve no real issue with them, i think their egos can be a bit touchy to critique, more so that others, and they have every right to think a game they wrote is the best after all who wouldn’t. I both love and hate an equal mix of their games, as has been covered here before. Parts of their engagement was quite unprofessional ranging from a suggestion that somebody shouldn’t comment unless they have good things to say (in a public group, now i could understand it in a games group) but also including posting a satirical post about dislike of Yorkshire tea in the authors style, now I’d be embarrassed I I felt the need to stoop to that level personally, never mind if it was related to business.

Anyway, I do feel for the author, even if i don’t completely agree with them to me this re-highlighted the Lardie community or “fan club” at its worst, and it was really disappointing to see some of it also come from the lardies themselves, in huge contest to all the great things they do like their gaming days.

 

[grantinvanman 10422xp 0]

I have never seen the “dark side of the Lard” @jamescutts so to speak – it’s always been a highly welcoming, fun set of rules but also adequately historical kind of place. Chain of Command was my go-to for WW2!

I guess with enough time and volume of players, there will be factions of detractors. Agreed that discourse can and should be more civil – that’s perhaps the more surprising part of all this.

 

[limburger 22547xp 0]

I’d counter with : It is Reddit …

Those communities are filled with the kind of neckbeards that will downvote anything that opposes their world view no matter how valid it is. You could have Newton posting the theory of gravity and still get downvoted to heck by the cultists and moderators of r/Physics for daring to provide actual evidence.

And that kind of mentality tends to infect the official accounts associated as well.

To say nothing of the bots that pretend to post things …

As for the book of Faesces … if that ‘Lardy Rich’ really is one of the authors of the rules then he should get of the internet pronto.
A guy posting his opinion on rules in a random wargaming group is doing exactly what those groups are for.
It’s like he can’t abide by reviews that aren’t 100% positive.
That definitely is cult-leader behaviour.

Seriously … if he thinks that original post was rude then he should be glad he hasn’t talked to the Dutch 😉

[grantinvanman 10422xp 0]

I just read the Reddit post. Apart from being nearly impossible to read, my favourite response was this one:

 

“

Dude, it seems like you just don’t like wargames? Like is your vendetta against wargames itself and this ruleset seems to have struck your ire in particular. It sounds like you are looking for a simulation and not the necessary extrapolation that is a wargame.

Maybe you should take up another hobby that gets you outside more, breathe some fresh air and move about. Might I recommend bird watching?”

 

Nailed it.

 

I don’t do Facebook so that’s not going to get read. I only use Reddit in fact on private browser and to catch top headlines of randomness. Social media … isn’t social.

[limburger 22547xp 1]

ah come on …

We love to hate on GW in here.
Why can’t someone do the same for Cain of Command ?
Why is it not allowed to look at a game and voice your opinions ?

Better out than in I’d say.

I’ve seen much worse out there.
Why can’t fanboys never ever admit that their favourite game has flaws too?
Why do they feel the need to make it into a personal attack if you dare to offer critique ?

An author that can’t handle comments like that and feels the need to tell someone to ‘touch grass’ is even worse.
It’s a game.
People are not going to play it like you designed it.
Ever.

They’re not going to write love stories about it either.

[phaidknott 7261xp 2]

Just…step…..away……from….the ….”community” (and don’t make eye contact). Even more stay away from all things REDDIT (as that way lies maddness).

 

Problem with anything online is that it’s an excellent format for people getting the wrong interpretation. If you were talking to a fellow gamer face to face them most of these disputes would never happen. No set of rules is ever perfect, and my rules at home have loads of crossing out and added home rules inserted between lines of text, down the margins, and some of MY house rules get crossed out half the time as I end up getting things wrong.

 

I started the hobby in a period where rules were often self published by individuals (rules that were ring bound or photocopied and stapled), or by wargames clubs themselves. And as the years have gone by, rules are more “professionally” published and often there’s a whole stable of rules from one individual (or small group). Sometimes trying to fit that “unique” mechanic that help to signify a stable of rules into different periods doesn’t always fit. But a rules author trying different mechanics across different periods (to better fit the period in question if you’re playing an historical game) can also end up with a bit of rebuke from gamers for attempting to do things out of the box (as they like to keep using the same mechanics for all their games in all periods).

 

And sometimes with success comes ego. Not always a bad thing (it’s the human condition). But then again constantly fielding questions/critical comments can cause a patient mindset to go astray from an author.

[onlyonepinman 18132xp 2]

I mean, this just sounds like all online communities.  Don’t get me wrong, I do feel your pain, but I don’t think your experience is unique.

[dags 4597xp 2]

I pondered a few replies to this, unusually it caught my attention.  Ii think in the end though I will just say I don’t think anyone involved achieved much beyond wasting time.

That said they did re-affirm my view that beyond seeing cool projects these online “communities” tend to add little to the hobby that is positive

The stuff on tabletop or paint desk is far better

[limburger 22547xp 1]

that’s why OTT is the superior community 😛
there’s wine, but also loads of cheese to be had here …

Other communities tend to be toxic tarpits of tedium, misery & doom.

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